Aw, being publicly shamed for being poor by my school president: a time I will remember fondly.

What would you prefer NYU do? Set aside simplistic things like “give me more money” or “make tuition lower” and offer a practical solution. I’m sure the administration would love to hear it, because they are obviously as concerned about this as everyone else.

If someone really wants to be a journalist and having internships is a big part of that, then doesn’t it make sense to attend a school where you will be able to save money and have the free time to take those internships?

Nobody should be prevented from attending a school simply because of their financial condition. However, that doesn’t mean that it’s wise for all students to attend whatever school they want to attend, regardless of the cost.

@Matthew: If only I had thought of those (very reasonable) arguments at age 18. But I don’t think a call from an NYU rep saying “should you really come here?!” would have deterred me from coming here.

It seems unfair to be critical of colleges/universities that can’t meet full need, although I admire schools that can and do. The problem isn’t one of an administration intent on screwing over the student body. Rather, it’s dysfunctional government policies that leave NYU et al. to pick up the slack.

For the last 20 years certain elements of the political class have worked hard to hamstring the government’s capability to provide public goods and today the burden falls to employers to provide healthcare, and institutions of higher learning to subsidize their student’s education.

Obviously, the administration’s methods are tactless but desperate times, etc.

@Jessica

I’m not trying to say that you should have, and I completely agree with you that the average 18-year old wouldn’t be deterred by that either. I honestly just don’t know what could be done. The only thing I can really think of is a letter that detailed exactly how much monthly student loan payments for $30k, $50k, $75k, etc. would be, and then calculated how much your estimated annual salary would have to be in order to make those payments manageable. Maybe a link to a web page that had a calculator to incorporate additional things like rent in NYC, NY taxes, etc.

I don’t think NYU or Sexton are trying to be unsympathetic, they’re just in a difficult position where they’re doing everything they can to improve the standing of NYU and its position as a “dream school” while also having to deal with the reality that the majority of NYU grads are not going into fields where they will be earning significant amounts of money.

I’ve seen the Post and Gawker pieces; this story has gotten twisted.

Here’s what this effort is all about: consumer information. It’s that straightforward. Financial aid is complex, and all NYU is trying to do is make sure families know what they’re getting into and are fully are.

We know that economics is a key reason that students don’t finish school. NYU has one of the highest percentages of Pell-eligible students among top research universities; we simply want the graduating class to be just as economically diverse as the entering class.

We wouldn’t hesitate to talk candidly with students if we thought there were academic issues that might prevent them from graduating; why wouldn’t we be as forthright about financial issues?

Also, this is not about income level, this is about need. A family with a relatively high income level may have circumstances that create great need. And in today’s economy, they may be among the most vulnerable.

Bottom line: we have these conversations precisely because we want these students here, and we handle these conversations thoughtfully and sensitively because we are respectful of families’ decisions about their own finances.

@ John Beckman

Just a clarification question: why are only certain admitted students receiving the call about aid? I understand your point about high-income families facing tough challenges, but the Post piece made it seem like only the poorer half of the class is being contacted, which is part of the issue, if that is the case: calling students who appear to be “at risk” shouldn’t be limited to students with little money. It should be an overall policy if it is to be done at all.

Your response?

good answer by Beckman in my opinion! Let’s not get on NYU’s case about being honest.

They aren’t going to call the rich kids about how the financial aid they aren’t going to receive is going to be small.

Also… Awesome article picture! Sooo perfect.

“Also, this is not about income level, this is about need. A family with a relatively high income level may have circumstances that create great need. And in today’s economy, they may be among the most vulnerable.”

ahahahahahaha fucking apologist, paid apologist

I understand the university saying that it is important to inform students and their families of the financial burden of pursuing a bachelor’s degree here. I also agree with the comment that age 18, one is probably too impetuous to be deterred by the idea of a 40,000 dollar loan. I know I certainly wasn’t and luckily my father was willing to back me and take out a big loan to help send me here.

The major point however that I want to hit on is that undergraduate students are at least in my opinion the ones paying for the bulk of the university’s bills and I believe that we are indeed entitled to complain that our tuition (undergrad) should be lowered or our financial should be increased. We don’t know how our tuition money spent and I personally believe that we don’t see many immediate benefits from it. I understand the administration saying that we are school that spends most of its endowment and thus can not afford scholarships like other schools but how much do we directly benefit from this spending? PhD students in GSAS get full-funding for five years, other major research universities don’t guarantee such funding to their students. NYU offers a loan-forgiveness program to its law students who pursue public interest work. What does NYU do to support its average CAS student? Nothing like those two examples. This university extends financial kindness to some and not to others. Granted there are more of us and less PhD students or law students but what does that lend itself to? Frankly it makes us undergrads seem like a pipeline of money to fund the university, I mean frankly the university could limit undergraduate enrollment if they wanted to provide more fully for us yet they do not. Programs like LSP, our ridiculously huge film and drama programs (really how much personal attention is devoted to the development of your artistry when your film program has 200 students every year or drama has 300) and several others don’t need to be here or just don’t need to be that big. Take Princeton for example… they have about 4,000-6,000 undergrads and guarantee to provide all their financial aid free of loans. Yes their endowment is significantly higher than NYU’s and many other universities but at the same time that university has also refused to expand its undergraduate enrollment over time even they could actually financially support it. This has allowed them to enjoy a nice endowment/per student ration. God knows what ours is but our ever-expanding student body is sure to keep that low and require us all to keep funding the university.

I’m upset that I don’t think things will change and I’m upset that the university’s practice of making these phone calls may offend some accepted students and their families. However to be fair it is important to ask people to reconsider coming here… the school is indeed expensive and the city is as well. Maybe there’s a less in-your-face way to do it but now more than ever people really do need to reconsider coming here because it is so expensive and the economy isn’t great. I will end on this much though- it is upsetting that some very talented students who may simply be unable to attend this university due to financial constraints will not get to contribute to our student body. It worries me that our university is more concerned with strategic plans and satellite campuses than the education and intellectual development of young minds… at least at the undergraduate level…

First of all, don’t ask why I’m writing this at two in the morning.

Secondly, I agree that NYU has no obligation to pay for its students’ educations, since it IS a private university. It can pretty much do whatever it wants. And I think it should do whatever it wants, within reason.

However, John Sexton could attempt to be a little more diplomatic. There’s no reason for him to come off like an elitist who deals with the matter in such a cavalier fashion. He is the president of the university… he should know how to sell the school in a better manner. If he wants to bring the school up to the status of the Ivies, which are known for giving killer financial aid, he might want to change his rhetoric. Even if it’s bullshit, at the very least it will give the impression that he cares, especially because NYU has historically taken in those who were not “wanted” by other universities because of their family/financial background.

I’m not saying that he doesn’t care, I’m just saying that based on his answers, the image he is portraying is one of someone who is more concerned with making money than educating people. I went to a private high school which pretty much had the same policy, but it at least did a better job at selling the school. Come on, J-Sex. Blair Waldorf isn’t going to do it all!

In response to Lucas: You have to distinguish between “wealth/lack of wealth” and “need,” which is what is evaluated in the financial aid office; “lack of wealth” and “need” are not the always the same thing. The calls were directed to those with greater need, and to those families who did not have prior experience with college because they were likely to be less familiar with financial aid.

NYU is in an unusual spot among universities — we’re very selective, and our scholarship and academics are highly regarded nationally, yet we do not have the per student endowment of the other top ranked universities with which we compete. NYU’s admissions are need blind — a family’s ability to pay does not play a role in our decision whether or not to admit. But because of its low per-student endowment, NYU is not among that group of universities that is able to meet full need — meaning there is a gap between what a family can pay and what NYU can provide in aid. We are upfront about this, and this effort is part of being upfront by being sure people are fully aware of the finances involved.

@ Josh Beckman: Doesn’t a person’s “wealth” play a role in determining “need” though? The FAFSA makes families list their net worth of investments and business/farm investments. So I don’t really understand your point. You’re saying that NYU doesn’t consider this when making the calculation for need? That sounds illegal, frankly, but hopefully I’m just not understanding correctly.

Furthermore, it’s fine for you to cite the smaller per-student endowment figure. But how much of the endowment pot are you guys actually spending every year? OH WAIT!! We can’t know because NYU doesn’t release it’s budget. Aw, shucks. And frankly, $2.5B is a lot of money. A LOT of money, and still one of the largest endowments among all colleges and universities in the country (#27, I think…).

I’m with Lucas on this: if you’re going to call some kids, then you need to call them all.

I believe that NYU financial aid is completely out of touch with the level of student dissatisfaction not only concerning the award itself, but also the shabby level of service that one receives when calling their office. It’s definitely a “We don’t want to help” mentality in that office, which is frankly reflective of the culture of this institution.

Why should they have to call everyone? I really don’t understand where Alex is coming from on this? NYU is trying to get people to actually attend their university, not scare all their prospective students into choosing another school…

@ Alex, – Very well put!

Oh, and how about the fact that the higher ups in the Administration (aka J-Sex) have not taken any pay cuts, yet the University is planning to cut pay for the lower end of the Admins.

J-Sex treats NYU like a corporation, so why doesn’t he follow suit and take a pay cut like all the other CEOs out there are doing? 900k dos seam like a bit much when other CEOs are working for dollars.

I couldn’t be happier with my experience at NYU even though it is a struggle to pay for. In the current climate there is no better place to invent money that in an education. If you do it right you can end up with a prestigious degree and a satisfying job, psychologically and economically. Take back NYU represents a small minority of to the tune of <1% and it is embarrassing that they get as much attention as they do when the silent majority are proud to be a part of the NYU community. Its a private school, the administration can run it however they want and they should. There are some of the most capable people in academia and business running our institution. Look at what our school was 30 years ago and where it is today. I want to thank the administration for what they have done for NYU’s students and alumni.

in response to Alex Brown:
Yes, but “wealth” as I used it — and I think as you are using it — is a generic term. The relation between “wealth” and “need” is not as simple or as straightforward as one might imagine when it comes to financial aid. FAFSA collects data to produce an “expected family contribution” based on a federal formula. It takes account of gross income and assets, but it subtracts for taxes, social security taxes, medical expenses, cost of living by family size, etc. “Need” is the difference between the full cost of attendance — tuition, fees, book, room and board (or commuting expenses) — and the family’s expected contribution. So, for instance, a family may have a relatively high income and virtually no assets and qualify for need-based aid.

As to the endowment: here’s information on its proportion of the overall budget — http://www.nyu.edu/about/budget/

“J-Sex treats NYU like a corporation, so why doesn’t he follow suit and take a pay cut like all the other CEOs out there are doing? 900k dos seam like a bit much when other CEOs are working for dollars.”

Yeah, but those CEOs who are currently working for dollars brought their companies to the ground. JSex, on the other hand, did the opposite. Look at where NYU was before JSex became president of the university. Look at NYU now. I think it’s safe to say that under Sexton, NYU has come a looong way, and is a better university for it.

With that said, I agree with Lucas. If you’re gonna call people, call everyone.

@Alex: “shabby level of service?”

Really? Maybe you keep catching them on bad days, because my experience with the financial aid office has been completely the opposite. And I call them often.

@Henry: Actually, quite a few of the CEOs working for little money were brought in after the previous ones destroyed the companies. But my point still stands, why cut the lower end of the spectrum when shaving off the top will be more beneficial.

@Nick: TBNYU, though they radicalized the student population, do have a lot of truth in what they say; there is a general malaise in the student feeling towards NYU as an institution. Classes, professors, friends, etc, are all positive, but dealing with NYU as a institution has left students feeling dissatisfied and ready to leave, because studetns here are treated as numbers as opposed to actual people. If there’s any snag in payments etc, too bad, you have to leave, as a few of my friends have had to do.

And Financial Aid people are great! (Sometimes a bit incompetent or unknowing, but uber friendly all the same) It’s the Bursar people you have to look out for.

I’m so glad I dropped out of NYU. I will graduate with no college debt and have the exact same opportunities.

exactly, ellie. you pay for living and studying in new york, but a great education can be had at other schools at half the price, for certain.

[...] questions about the university, the 2031 plans, NYU Abu Dhabi, financial aid and tuition, and the recent decision to call poorer students to warn them of the cost of NYU. Sexton even talked a bit about the [...]

[...] “Students Dissatisfied with Financial Aid.” You may also recall that, last semester, the school began calling students with a large gap between their need and their financial aid award to make sure [...]